WHAT????? Charlie moves in with Jill??? I hope that's because she's dying and needs full-time, round-the-clock medical care!!!
Okay, what I'm thinking is not pretty! But, if this is going to be the cliff-hanger episode, I am going to be extremely disappointed.
I will have to dwell on your comments Councilman and come back later. But I agree with you, Hank needs to forget Jill if this new development (Charlie moving in with Jill) is anything remotely resembling romance or of economic convenience. That being said, it dismays me (though life is filled with such examples) that Hank would run head-long into a relationship with a woman he new very little about and then base his reason for staying in the Hampton's largely on that attraction (or the promise of something more with Jill).
Hank is a great guy, I wish I knew real doctors like him.
TTYL

I can relate too easily with what someone in Hanks situation would be going through. He was in love with a woman he thought loved him but it turned out she was in love with being in love with a successful doctor and who it was was not all that important to her. Hank saw this and so he bailed in the knowledge it wasn't true love. Then he starts out with someone he thinks is honest and genuine but it turns out she wasn't really honest with Hank or herself and in the process she was wishy washy a couple of times until that minute Hank left her office and Charlie closed the door and Hank smiled and shock his head, knowing full well that she had problems.
Sadly knowing the way writers are they are going to try make us feel bad about her being duped by Charlie. But I have to go back to the old adage, fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me. Now we have to hope that Hank will take that to the next level and realize it was two different women who screwed him over emotionally. Trouble is some of us tend to project our ethics and values on to others who don't deserve it, and I can't blame him for it having done it myself. The trick would to get the writers to let Hank grow past Jill and move on to someone who really deserves his attention. But I'm a dreamer.

I'm disappointed though. I think the writers rushed this relationship (Hank and Jill), and now they have to back paddle. They should have kept it professional but flirtatious; or better yet, there should have been a power struggle between the two that eventually turned into admiration and love.
Hank looked really hurt when he closed the door to Jill and Charlie (kudos to Mark F's acting abilities). I'm not sure what the writers have in mind for the Hank-Jill relationship, I don't even want to venture a guess at this point.
Please keep dreaming Councilman, it makes the world a better place. :)

I have a guess for what Jill & Hank will do next season. They are going to unset some of us by getting back together at some point and lowering my esteem for Hank and make me question the brain power of the goofy people who make this stuff up.
I like this show but it looks like if C-man is right Jill is unstable and it's too bad.

Upset UPSET! Heck yes I will be upset;. Notice I said will and not would. These lame brain writers don't care what they have to do messing with characters to keep us on a roller coaster ride. As I said at some point Charles will go to his old ways and Jill will say "I don't know what I was thinking, I knew he'd never change. I'm sorry Hank I never should have doubted you. It will never happen again". At that point I'd love to be the writer. If I were I'd say: "Frankly my dear I don't give a damn. Have you met Bambi my new girl friend the lingerie model. She'll be 22 next month".
Like that could happen. lol

Yay Jill!
Finally, she's figuring it out.

Okay Guys, I appreciate how strongly you feel about the Hank + Jill thing. Everyone has been and will get hurt many times during their lifetime, it's inevitable. It's cool that you're sensitive to that, but I honestly think that these TWO characters are evolving and we need to give them a little leeway. I HATE to see Hank hurt, he's a good guy and doesn't deserve to be hurt. On the other hand, aren't we ALL striving to be better people? We don't live in a bubble and we certainly couldn't grow in one if we did. We grow by moving through obstacles, not around them. He is going to have to face the realities of his feelings for Jill; whatever Hank decides about Jill and/or their relationship will make him a better man. What I'm saying is, give them some time. Jill and Hank have a lot in common. Recall: they have both been seriously burned in previous relationships. They could find a lot of sympathy and love in their common ground.

So Dr. Laura is leaving the building...bye! (wink, wink) See you guys next time.

Some of us are not striving to be a better person as much as we are simply looking for someone worthy of our trust and love. You said: "We grow by moving through obstacles, not around them." I think we can grow strong by using the excursive of growing around obstacles to help us grow. Getting hurt is not inevitable because somewhere out there, there might still be people who don't lie and cheat and who know the true meaning of love and commitment.
I think if Hank were a real person he'd be thinking, how can I ever trust another woman who is unwilling to
make a commitment and mean it. I believe he can easily see himself sitting alone from now on in front
of an unlit fireplace on a dark cold stormy night in an otherwise empty house with an empty wine glass, only wishing there was someone who he could love, and share a quiet evening in front of a warm fire and not have to say a word to convey the love they share. A woman who thinks more about their happiness as a couple than she does about herself.
But I could be wrong. Some people thrive in loveless meaningless relationships where one or both participants are lying cheating no good worthless people like so many are these days. No one should have to work at love. Just being honest and willing to give of yourself and be yourself should be enough for anyone.

This picture is just a dream anyone might enjoy living for real.

Congratulations C-man I think you got it right about today's relationships being shallow and meaningless to far too many. The warm fireplace on a cold evening sounds better than just nice. But then I have found myself in a less than admirable relationship with a less than honest person, whom I would not wish on a bad guy.
I know just where I would like to spend this quiet evening.

I disagree with you C'man, you do have to work at love. Love is a decision you make and a promise you keep.

(Though I think it's evident that you're a true romantic! BTW, What do you do for a living?)

MY POV:
FIRST OF ALL, two people may not be together for the same reason. PEOPLE often put their best foot forward during the pursuit, and afterwards, when they settle into their relationship their NORMAL ROUTINE resurfaces. Meanwhile, their partner thinks that they have suddenly MORPHED (they wonder if they made a mistake) - a young person may see this as threat to the stability of their relationship. TYPICALLY, the guy does the "full-court press" during the pursuit and the girl (thinking this is HOW-HE-REALLY-ACTS) thinks he's changed after the relationship (especially marriage) is established. THAT"S DANGEROUS THINKING.

Anyone can marry for love, companionship, or sex. But in every case (situation), it takes more than any of those elements to make it work.

If you marry for love, Mr or Mrs Right is not always going to be Romantically-Inclined, LONG TALKS at bedtime, Cuddles by the fireplace, Candlelight dinners, Walks along the beach aren't always going to be possible (or practical).

If you marry for companionship, Mr or Mrs Right is not always going to be available. They had a life before you, some things will continue afterwards (some hobbies, some pursuits, some projects, etc). You would not want said person to be devoted to you and only you - you would get bored!

If you marry for sex, whether its conscience-driven (you don't want to sin) or it's convenience-driven (safe and satisfying lover), hormones, work, and health issues offer counter-inconveniences.

GETTING HURT is a part of life, even in a mutually-satisfying, healthy relationship. We are constantly growing and learning and living. (GETTING HURT TEACHES US HOW TO BE IN A RELATIONSHIP) Relationships are dynamic (THANK GOD) because people are dynamic. Hurt can come in many forms: loss of a job and the struggle to find self-worth in the aftermath (effects both sexes); disappointment in a goal that wasn't met (and a partner that can't relate to that or has little interest in that project); stress that leads to hurtful words ill-spoken (effects each sex); changing interests that were once a common-ground (can threaten a relationship that was based on this common interest); disappointment in family or children (differing parental styles - husband working harder to support children and is gone more often and a wife that bears the responsibility - feeling somewhat slighted, but also sees the child's hurtful looks when daddy doesn't show up). THERE ARE NUMEROUS EXAMPLES.

From my own life: I got married in June of 1990. My husband was in the Military, stationed at Ft. Stewart, Georgia. We had been married 6 weeks when he went into lock-down for deployment to Iraq. I kissed him every day through a metal fence at an airplane hangar. He left and was gone for almost eight months (I FINALLY FOUND MR RIGHT AND NOW I DIDN"T KNOW IF I WOULD EVER SEE HIM AGAIN). I had to change (to cope), he had to change (to survive), our happy pizza-eating-movie-watching nights became a shared history. Our priorities and our visions CHANGED us. When he returned, our lives changed too. Who could have known he would go to war? We have been through so much together. BUT, we are both different people. Some of the things that drew us together have changed, our hobbies have changed, our careers have changed. BUT WE STAYED TOGETHER.

BECAUSE:LOVE IS SOMETHING YOU HAVE TO WORK AT: LOVE IS A DECISION AND A PROMISE THAT YOU KEEP.

Life hands us obstacle after obstacle after obstacle. We all work to overcome those obstacles. NO ONE deserves love just because they breathe air and have the right tools. Just being yourself isn't enough. Human beings come with a unique set of genes, childhood, social history and problem-solving skills; putting two human beings together and saying "be yourself and all will be well" will surely result in a let-down, if not a catastrophe. :(

Well, I am finished with my SHARE. And though Hank is not a real character, he represents the hopes of a real man, to find love and happiness. To be sure, many viewers find Jill neither attractive nor suitable for Hank, but Hank comes with a history (just like Jill), something that can grow, teach and make him better (whether that's with Jill or not is still to be determined).

Hope everyone has a wonderful weekend!

I really can't believe you said this and I quote:"Love is a decision you make and a promise you keep."
If people decided they would fall in love it wouldn't be love at all. You can't decide what's in your heart it is either there or it's not. When I wake up in the morning I decide what I'll wear when I look into eyes of a woman and all I ever want to do from that moment on is be with her every minute of every day, I didn't decide it love dictated it to heart and then to my head not the other way around. I equate it very closely with some of our core beliefs. For example if you are a Christian you can't decide you you are going to believe in God. You can read and learn discuss all your life but until the presents of the spirit washes over you and enters your heart involuntarily all you are is a student of the word. Mat be you don't believe and that would be fine to but at some point an event could take place that you can't ignore that will convince you in your heart that not only that you believe but you didn't decide it it came to you. One example might be an NDE or (near death experience)believe me it will get your attention and remove any doubt.
Some people love never comes to or they choose to ignore what their heart is telling them. Others understand that love is not controlled by what we think it is controlled by what our heart tells us to do, and that reacquires no work. If you have to work at being in love it's not love. It's working at being in love and I believe it will be doomed to fail. An old adage says love means never having to say you're sorry. Do you know why that is a correct statement? It's because if you're in love with someone you will never knowingly do anything to hurt or upset them. Love is forever not for a few minutes, hours, days, weeks, I really can't believe you said this and I quote:"Love is a decision you make and a promise you keep."
If people decided they would fall in love it wouldn't be love at all. You can't decide what's in your heart it is either there or it's not. When I wake up in the morning I decide what I'll wear when I look into eyes of a woman and all I ever want to do from that moment on is be with her every minute of every day, I didn't decide it love dictated it to heart and then to my head not the other way around. I equate it very closely with some of our core beliefs. For example if you are a Christian you can't decide you you are going to believe in God. You can read and learn discuss all your life but until the presents of the spirit washes over you and enters your heart involuntarily all you are is a student of the word. Mat be you don't believe and that would be fine to but at some point an event could take place that you can't ignore that will convince you in your heart that not only that you believe but you didn't decide it it came to you. One example might be an NDE or (near death experience)believe me it will get your attention and remove any doubt.
Some people love never comes to or they choose to ignore what their heart is telling them. Others understand that love is not controlled by what we think it is controlled by what our heart tells us to do, and that reacquires no work. If you have to work at being in love it's not love. It's working at being in love and I believe it will be doomed to fail. An old adage says love means never having to say you're sorry. Do you know why that is a correct statement? It's because if you're in love with someone you will never knowingly do anything to hurt or upset them. Love is forever not for a few minutes, hours, days, weeks, I really can't believe you said this and I quote:"Love is a decision you make and a promise you keep."
If people decided they would fall in love it wouldn't be love at all. You can't decide what's in your heart it is either there or it's not. When I wake up in the morning I decide what I'll wear when I look into eyes of a woman and all I ever want to do from that moment on is be with her every minute of every day, I didn't decide it love dictated it to heart and then to my head not the other way around. I equate it very closely with some of our core beliefs. For example if you are a Christian you can't decide you you are going to believe in God. You can read and learn discuss all your life but until the presents of the spirit washes over you and enters your heart involuntarily all you are is a student of the word. Mat be you don't believe and that would be fine to but at some point an event could take place that you can't ignore that will convince you in your heart that not only that you believe but you didn't decide it it came to you. One example might be an NDE or (near death experience)believe me it will get your attention and remove any doubt.
Some people love never comes to or they choose to ignore what their heart is telling them. Others understand that love is not controlled by what we think it is controlled by what our heart tells us to do, and that reacquires no work. If you have to work at being in love it's not love. It's working at being in love and I believe it will be doomed to fail. An old adage says love means never having to say you're sorry. Do you know why that is a correct statement? It's because if you're in love with someone you will never knowingly do anything to hurt or upset them. Love is forever not for a few minutes, hours, days, weeks, ad infinitum, it is forever.
One does not decide to love your children or Mom and Dad it's in your heart. Love comes to you when you least expect it some times, and you'll know when comes to you and you will never see it as work. All it requires is being the person you are truly meant to be and following the golden rule that you can find in every religion and is at the core of every cultures teachings. "Do unto others as you would have others do unto you."
Am I a true romantic and always have been. As to what I do. You would never believe me. I will say I have degrees and training in many areas.
Every day is a new day full of the wonders of this miraculous world we are privileged to be a part of. True Love is one of those wonders and we should embrace and never fear it.

As a matter of fact C'man, I am a Christian as is my husband. We have learned that love for one another, just like our love and our relationship with God, is based on a decision (a commitment), not a feeling. Love isn't a feeling. The flutters at the touch of a hand, the brush of a kiss, etc, those are biological reactions. Those reactions result from sensations that are relayed to our brain. They really have nothing to do with love. That's all sensual and emotional. (Don't get me wrong, they are good to have, but that's not the love I'm talking about).

We all know there are different kinds of love: Agape (unconditional love), Phileo (friendship), Eros (Romantic/Erotic), and Storge ( Familial).

I'm not talking about walking down the street, seeing some attractive person and saying: hmmmm...I think I'll fall in love with them.

Not at all. I'm talking about the commitment you make that transcends feelings. I stand by my statement, "Love is a decision you make and a promise you keep."

Well then we will have to dis agree because I believe there are are things in this world that defy the idea that decisions are involved. You see I have had the NDE I talked about. I have also had the presents and spirit of something more powerful than I wash over me and defy all logic even confound a world renowned Doctor in the process, The only decision involved was my acceptance of the events, what I felt and saw happening to and around me.
I have also experienced for a time the Love I tend to Preach about and have seen the bad results when people who don't allow their heart to rule their actions. You can't in my mind wake up one day and say I'm not going to love my spouse any longer. Not if they were ever in your heart to begin with. When you love is only in your head and not your heart and soul then it can lead to the title of the book that I have been working on. The title is so profound I decided to copyright it before I publish the book. The Title is "I Love You and Other Lies I've Been Told."
To me promises and commitment come automatically with true love and we stand before man and God to proclaim it freely and openly. What ever works to keep to people together is a wonderful thing I just prefer my definition because to it means to it is for ever and not based on a transient thought or whim. But hey that's me.
It seems I'm not just a romantic but also an old fashion dreamer.
Here's a little something about Love for you and your loved one, and that includes everyone who reads it.

Reflections In The Clock

As I grew up all I had was time to play and just goof off.
But as the years caught up with me I've seen reflections in the clock.
The man I see is much old than the years I feel inside my mind.
The reflections in clock tell me no one can hide from time.
They say it's not the years but the mileage takes the toll
Reflections in the clock will say it's not the mind but the body growing old.
God I feel so good sometimes I'd love to run through open fields.
When I stand bones are creaking and it's awful how I feel.
But this is not about how bad it can be with problems and afflictions.
It's about how happy in my mind I can be looking at the clock and it's reflections.
So I can't run or jump or climb, now here comes the a shock.
I happy with my dreams of you and me when I see reflections in the clock.

Copyright ©2007 Dave Mitchell

C'man,

Hi!

I don't think you are reading my posts carefully enough. I am saying something very similar to what you are saying with one exception, "REAL love, the kind that lasts, isn't BASED on emotions."

If SOMEONE wakes up one day and says, "I've fallen out of love with so-and-so", it's because THEY decided to. If they've made a promise to that person, ie., engagement or marriage, then they're in trouble because they haven't lived up to their promise."

What promise? "Love is a decision you make, a promise you keep." Do you really LOVE someone if you are willing to walk out on them or on your promise? Love is the Hope of All Things Possible. It rings in the heart of lovers like magical chimes, it whispers all kinds of future possibilities, it is two lives knitted together as one. It says "We".

When a person walks away from a relationship (with the exception of abuse), they are saying "I". they are no longer keeping their promise and that decision is most often based on sensual reasonings:

"I don't feel this...I don't feel that...He doesn't this...She doesn't that..." And so on and so-forth. Love based on EMOTIONS is doomed. Love based on a decision (commitment) fares far better.

Obviously, we are all human beings, naturally flawed, quirky and unique, so it requires (my opinion) an ultra-human effort to keep that commitment, to honor that decision...to LOVE someone.

That's what I'm trying to say.

As this relates to Hank and Jill (which started this discussion), I think they have unique common grounds (painful x-relationships) and common interests (a desire to care for the sick and infirmed), common sensibilities (they aren't unduly impressed with wealth), and similar resolve (they both - though not to the same degree - stand up for themselves). Therein lies the framework of a potentially successful relationship (not to be confused with good sex).

WILL THE WRITERS LEAD US THERE? WHO KNOWS?

But as a writer myself, I can see that the "Hank + Jill" relationship could work. If this were a novel I was writing, I would put many obstacles in the way of both characters, their careers, and their relationship, so that my readers could discover the depth of their mental and moral dilemmas, and could cheer or worry for them, that's what makes a good story.

Take care, and have a great day!

I still disagree with you Love is mans most complex emotion and all the decisions you speak of come after the emotion takes hold.